Restaurant Hospitality: La Padrona
Designing Delight: Serving Experiences, Not Just Meals
In this episode, we sit down with Eric Papachristos, the restaurateur behind some of Boston’s most iconic dining destinations, including top rated La Padrona, Trade, Porto, Saloniki Greek, and The Venetian. Known for blending elevated design with thoughtful hospitality, Eric shares how he builds restaurants that feel both personal and unforgettable.
We explore how design can serve as a strategic tool, how to create scalable yet intimate guest experiences, and what it takes to thrive in one of the most competitive industries around. Whether you're in hospitality or just fascinated by the business of human connection, this is a conversation you won’t want to miss.
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I'm really excited today to welcome Eric Papachristos.
Eric is a Boston based restaurateur, real estate developer and a founder of A Street Hospitality, A dynamic group behind some of Boston's most celebrated restaurants including Trade Porto, Saliniki Greek, La Padrona and The Venetian.
1:20
Known for blending thoughtful design with exceptional culinary experiences, Eric has built a reputation as a visionary in modern hospitality.
Raising Greece and rooted in traditions, Eric brings a strong European sensibility to his work.
He's especially passionate about storytelling through food, design and service, curating environments that are both elevated and welcoming.
1:43
His Greek heritage inspired the creation of Saliniki Greek, a fast casual brand with five locations in Boston that pays homage to his cultural roots.
Eric's upcoming project, The Swan Room, and its private counterpart, The Swan Club, located one of Boston's most premier hotels, is poised to be one of the city's most exclusive dining and membership experiences.
2:04
What is The Swan Room?
Inspired by venues like Casa Cipriani and Milanese Design, it will serve as a modern social club for Boston's tastemakers If we can.
Guest lecturer at Northeastern University and Suffolk University, Eric shares insights on entrepreneurship, brand development, and building businesses with Seoul.
2:23
His leadership style blends hands on operational rigor with an aspirational brand vision.
Eric is also a tastemaker in the world's of luxury lifestyle, fashion and international culinary travel with partnerships and interests that span across hospitality, architecture and high end living.
2:41
Eric, thank you so much for being on a natural selection.
Welcome.
2:45
Speaker 1
Thank you for having me excited.
2:47
Speaker 2
I'm excited too.
Clearly from your bio, you cover a lot of ground and so I think we can go in so many different directions.
But in simple terms, what business are you in and what is your role within that?
3:02
Speaker 1
I'm in the business of creating high impact hospitality and real estate experiences that scale culture, community and design.
3:11
Speaker 2
Since the focus is around innovation, really the objective here is to talk to pioneers such as you that are really redefining their fields and in innovating in a way that's makes them more competitive compared to others.
And in the restaurant and the, the hospitality industries are intensely competitive.
3:33
What is the Swan Club?
You know, I just, I'm not in the field, but I just see the restaurants all over Boston and I can only imagine and hopefully we can unpack some of that here about what it takes to compete in those spaces.
But if we think about the the context of restaurants and hospitality, what does innovation mean to you when it comes to differentiating something new that you're going to do like Swan Room or keeping current establishments like Trade and Porto innovative without necessarily damaging the brand that the your clientele has grown to love?
4:12
Speaker 1
You know, for us in hospitality, a lot of it is chicken and the egg.
And certainly in my career, you know, in the beginning you're always chasing, you're chasing what do people want?
What do people want?
And I think that's the plight of many restaurant tours early on in their careers.
4:32
And as soon as you start to become successful, you start to understand what you're actually giving to your guests and to your community and to your city and restaurants, for lack of a better word.
You know, we are a very strong fabric in American culture.
4:51
And now it's really international culture.
Food travel is huge.
Instagram is really all about food.
I mean, that was really, you know, one of the biggest sort of inspirations for Instagram and still is.
5:06
Speaker 3
And so early in the career.
5:09
Speaker 1
Of restaurant tour, it is about giving people what they want and then once you're able to catch up and be successful, now you have to be thinking a little bit forward.
And I think that's where it gets really tricky for us because, you know, trends change really quickly and can you really teach your consumer for your guest?
5:33
And I think that gets really, really hard for us because our margins are so tight.
We want to be exploratory, we want to be innovative, but it's really, really hard to make it sustainable because our margins are so razor thin.
And so even if you can get ahead of the curve and now you're innovating and now you're sort of leading the charge in your neighborhood and your city and your country, you know, that's where it comes like really, really impactful.
5:59
But we're we're always scared of that innovation because how far forward can you really take chicken as an example?
6:07
Speaker 2
You know, a factor here is human psychology, right?
Because you're really dealing with tastes, you're dealing with aesthetics, you're dealing with an experience.
And so, you know, when you think about, let's say, for example, Swan Room and Swan Club, where do you come up with the concepts of you can do so many different things, right?
6:29
And I know that there is an element obviously of Greek to what you do because of your heritage, but it's not just focused on that.
So really you kind of diversify.
You can do a number of different things.
And so given how many different directions that you go in when you're thinking about that next premier hotspot, what's the process of ideation that you go through, say this is it, this is the one that I want to do?
6:55
The process of ideation
Yeah, I think actually a really good example is our current restaurant, which has been open for just about a year now called La Pedrona at the Raffles Hotel.
So really how to embody this hotel coming to the city two years before it opened?
And so I really had to do a lot of research and go travel internationally and stay at the Raffles Hotel.
7:15
And what is the brand who is going to Raffles?
What does the broad audience know about Raffles, and why did they pick Boston?
And so I begin from there because I ultimately have to think about who my guest is who is coming in for dinner.
7:30
Speaker 3
And.
7:31
Speaker 1
Raffles is, you know, an amazing luxury brand, and their first hotel in all of America is here in Boston.
So we were, as a Bostonian, we're extremely proud of that.
So I knew that my concept couldn't be vanilla, couldn't be boring.
7:47
I had to push the envelope.
Nobody asked me to, but I knew that I had to in order.
7:53
Speaker 3
For us to be.
7:54
Speaker 1
Cool and hip and see what can work here in Boston.
So a lot of my research is travel is going to cities around the world and seeing who's doing what with interesting spaces, with interesting food and hospitality.
8:12
What are people looking for?
How are they dining?
How are they breaking bread with their friends, families and loved ones?
You know, that's very, very important.
And you know, knowing as much as I did about the Raffles Hotel, I was able to really go to New York and, and bring on what I believe to be the best design firm in the world in hospitality.
8:35
And we built an amazing, amazing product.
My team has been with me for decades, really.
So they knew what I was asking of them to do.
And what I really love about La Petrona is that people, when they come in, and certainly when we first opened, they said, you know, Boston really needed this.
8:55
Where has this been?
And so, you know, that was a very proud moment for us.
And in the Boston Globe review recently, which was an exceptional review, had mentioned exactly that, You know, where has this been all along?
9:12
We've been waiting for this in the city.
So now for my next project, you know, I have to not put on the same hat, but where we get a little bit nervous is again thinking of our guest.
9:23
Speaker 3
And thinking for me there's.
9:25
Speaker 1
There's sort of really two sides.
There's one is a very conscious side.
So is my guest, you know, a 32 year old banker that lives in downtown Boston, or is it a 56 year old?
9:38
Speaker 3
Software developer that.
9:39
Speaker 1
Lives in Wellesley and what is going to bring them into the space and what do I have to do?
So really that the technical the hard stuff for me is thinking about who is exactly coming into our space.
Are they going home to change and shower before they come in?
9:54
Is this just to grab a cocktail?
Do they need a private membership space because they're having some high-powered meetings?
So really thinking about the technicalities, but what which which is?
10:04
Speaker 3
Really tough again and and I know the city.
10:07
Speaker 1
Really.
Well, so I have a little bit of a competitive advantage.
I've been living in downtown Boston for the better part of 30 years, so I know who's here and I know how the city has evolved.
So that's a little bit of my cheat code.
10:19
Speaker 3
But the other part.
10:21
Speaker 1
For me, that really inspires me is my muse.
And who is that muse?
As an example, when I was designing La Pedrone, you know, I was a single guy in my mid 40s, early mid 40s.
10:37
And I was like thinking, where, where is my wife?
Where is this woman that I want to meet?
What is she wearing?
What is she drinking?
What is she eating?
What does she want to listen to?
What does she want the, the space to feel around her?
And sort of ironically, so, you know, if I walk into La Pajona any night of the week, you know, all these women, they're very much fit the profile of the type of woman that I've wanted to be in there, right?
11:06
So that was my muse in the moment.
So, you know, for for every project, I have to think from that creative side as well, the technicalities of location and neighborhood and price point and menu.
But it's also really the the artistic side is probably the most fun for me.
11:24
Speaker 2
Yeah, that's, that's really interesting.
11:26
User-Centric Design and Artistic Experiences
As you were talking about this, it's such a fascinating space, right?
Because I talked to people from different industries and, and a lot of times they're very business oriented and all inspirational.
I mean, I talked to the guy from NASA and you know, the way they think about innovation is exceptional.
11:46
When I hear you talk, it's I, I heard elements that call to other parts of my life.
You were talking not in the same terms, but kind of user centric design right there.
You think about that in software development and product development, you are developing a product and you have a user centric design, you have a an avatar, you have a prototype of a user and a demographic.
12:12
And you say, OK, what's the experience that this person is looking for and how do I design that?
But then you also have this romantic and artistic element to it, which is about the experience.
It's about your vision and how you would want to experience this as well.
12:27
And and all of it folded up into what turns out to be the product of the service and eventually the brand as well.
12:35
Speaker 1
Correct.
Yeah, It it's it there's a lot of passion to what we do because sort of the second layer of what we do, the thing that's really tough for us is it's hard to digitize what we do.
12:50
It's hard to standardize and create our SO PS because everything that we do is so human, right?
There's AI has almost, I mean, I do use as much, you know, chat GPP as I can really for my development legal SOP that those sort of things.
13:10
But no one, no guest will ever come into the restaurant.
And I say this to my general managers all the time.
As much as I want them to be very clean cut in their organizational behavior and their communication, no guest ever is going to walk in and say, man, this general manager has the best e-mail skills.
13:29
They reply to emails right away, I guess just wants to be romanticized.
When they come into the restaurant, they want to have a great dining experience.
They want to feel like a king or a queen and they, yes, they want the server to come there to the table and write down with a pen and paper chicken and turn around and give chicken.
13:48
Of course, any computer, any device, you can text the kitchen if you want.
But in that moment, you know, it just the humanity of what we do is anything but digitized.
And I think our guests, you know, generally and hospitality really want that.
14:05
And you know, one of the other things that's extremely important in the way that I talk with my staff, because what's really important for me is the feeling of walking into a restaurant is the same feeling that I had when I walked into my grandmother's house.
14:20
There was this unconditional love.
You didn't care what you put on the table.
You knew that it was going to be good.
You know that you put a lot of love into it.
And so, you know, that for us is just critically important in what we do, and it's just hard to digitize it.
14:37
Speaker 2
So much of what goes into your design is about creating a unique and personalized experience to every person that walks in that door.
14:50
How to create a unique and personalized experience
And, and I'm sure there are tricks of the trade like in every other industry, but, and, and I'm sure part of that is also having to have a very clear focus on your clientele, because if it's a very diverse clientele, there's no chance of doing something like that.
15:07
So you've got to think to yourself, OK, who's coming into this restaurant, this hotel, this restaurant?
What are they looking for?
What other experiences that have they had?
And then how do we make something so unique for them that they're going to remember this?
15:20
Speaker 1
Right, right.
15:21
Speaker 2
So when you think about how the industry has evolved, you know, taste don't stay constant.
They evolve customers, patrons evolve, their tastes evolve society changes and technology changes as well.
15:42
How has how does that manifest into how you think about your next thing or how you evolve your current restaurants, right.
Nothing is static and so much of what you do revolves around taste, which there's nothing written on that.
15:59
It's it's, it's a very much a feel.
So how how do you stay ahead of evolving times?
16:05
How to stay ahead of the changing times
You mentioned COVID that I'm sure had a huge effect on the restaurant and hospitality industry.
Technology has an effect.
You mentioned ChatGPT, but also people order a lot.
People want to be able to use technology for making reservations and people leave ratings on restaurants.
16:26
So, so much of what restaurants are today has changed so dramatically in the last 10-15 years.
And and how does that factor into the things that you do?
16:39
Speaker 1
So for me, when I I I grew up in Greece.
16:44
Speaker 3
And I.
16:47
Speaker 1
Was eating my grandmother's food literally in a village, the village, rural village, about 1000 people.
If you wanted bread, you go down the street.
There's one Baker in the village.
You wanted eggs.
Your grandmother had chickens in the backyard.
17:04
You wanted milk.
The cow was downstairs.
Go downstairs and milk it and boil the milk.
And so I learned at an early age, really just eating Whole Foods, right?
I mean, it's such a.
17:16
Speaker 3
Sort of.
17:17
Speaker 1
Either a taboo or a or a cliche word.
Not nowadays.
You know, Whole Foods and whole nutrition and all of that.
17:22
Speaker 3
But.
17:24
Speaker 1
You know, humans, you know, we, we ate and I don't know what the right term is, but really what's surrounding us physically.
And you can see that culturally around the world and sort of in anthropology, you know, people in in Peru, you know, that is a very potato based diet.
17:45
I think they have over 10,000 varieties of potatoes.
You can see what they are physical structure as humans is.
And then you can look at, you know, people in Africa have a very different structural build, you know, muscle and bone on them.
18:02
And a lot of that had to do with or if not mostly had to do with how you were consuming your calories and what was your nutrition.
And So what what's happened today is because of innovation, because of, you know, digital technologies, access to foods that is not native to your city, town, state, make country, you know, gets processed.
18:28
And so we're we're, we're now kind of like always eating processed foods.
So when we're thinking about trends, we really have to think about, you know, at a super high level, how are people thinking about their their food sources?
18:47
And right now, you know, certainly vegan and vegetarian based diets were sort of en vogue pre COVID.
You know, I think now there's, there's a lot more emphasis on, on animal protein.
You know, we, we hear that a lot in sort of mainstream media as well.
19:03
Politics has a big thing to to do with it as well.
19:06
Speaker 3
You know we have Robert F Kennedy now.
19:10
Speaker 1
You know, he's got his agenda and that that he's pushing out again, particularly from a food standpoint.
So we are listening to all those big macro trends on on what's cool and what's not.
But here specifically in the US, we also have to think about who is cooking the food.
19:28
So not just the food, but actually who is cooking the food.
And so because of the I immigrant population that we have here, which has been extremely helpful for the restaurant and hospitality and industry in general, you know, those are the people that are working in our kitchen.
19:45
So what does that mean?
You know, they're familiar.
You know when we have what's called family meal?
Family meal is before the guests come in, all the staff sit down and eat so.
19:55
Speaker 3
Typically the family meals.
19:56
Speaker 1
As the cooks and the chefs can decide that day what they want to cook for everybody.
And it's typically, you know, cuisine from Central of South America because that's really what they know.
And that's really their expertise.
It's really hard.
20:09
Speaker 3
You know I have.
20:09
Speaker 1
6 Greek restaurants and it's really hard for me to teach people why oregano is so important oregano is very big in in, you know mainland Greece, but here it's very hard to teach someone because.
20:24
Speaker 3
They they've never tasted.
20:25
Speaker 1
Oregano until now and sort of the same thing for us, you know, for, you know, a Greek, you know, avocado is never, you know, avocados and bananas.
I didn't know anything about that growing up in Greece.
And you come here now and, you know, every little store has avocados and and bananas.
20:40
So, you know, as we think about food, a big part of it is not just, you know, what is the food source, what is the macro trend, but also who's cooking.
And what we've also seen now is, you know, it's a people love to go out to restaurants.
20:58
They love, love to go out to restaurants, but nobody likes to work in restaurants anymore.
Everyone, you know, these young adults, I think at some point during COVID, there was a statistic that came out that said 90% of Americans at some point in their life worked in restaurants.
21:15
And I think that statistic is going lower and lower and lower because there's a very physically demanding job.
You're on your.
21:22
Speaker 3
Feet.
21:23
Speaker 1
You're not on your device and everyone is sort of, you know, hooked on that device feeling and that, you know, thing of holding their phone.
It's really hard to turn around, be at a hot grill and, you know, in the moment you got to kick out 30 cheeseburgers and, you know, 22 orders of French fries and tuna tartare.
21:43
And, you know, you get this, you know, crazy environment.
So we don't see the young population that wants to come into culinary as much as they did from, you know, from the 1980s to up until, you know, 2020, there was just a, you know, great demand for people wanting to be young chefs and prove themselves.
22:03
We don't see that anymore these days.
It's really tough.
22:07
Speaker 2
It's interesting.
I in, in preparation for this, I did some background research and I, it did come up actually labor shortages.
22:15
Labor shortages
And so I wasn't sure if I was going to ask you or not, but you, you brought it up.
So how do you cope with that?
I mean, I worked in restaurants all throughout college.
It was just, not only, it was, was it a great way of making earning a living?
22:31
It was also super flexible way when you're got school and it's like, I can only work Thursday or Friday nights.
It's like, well, what other industry are you going to find where you can work those hours, right?
And, and make a good, a good salary?
And, and, and I agree.
I mean, everybody I knew back then worked in restaurants.
22:48
So with the labor shortage that you just mentioned and that I read up on, how do you cope with that?
Does it mean you have to use more technology, more automation?
How or, or is it just bringing in the right people?
It's going to be harder to find that, but then you have to work really hard at keeping them so that they don't leave you.
23:07
How do you deal with that kind of Labor shortage, especially sorry, especially when your experience is so unique.
You're not pumping out burgers, you know, for people, you're really trying to develop an experience.
So, so part of that experience are your frontline staff, your cooks, everybody from front to back has to be so perfectly aligned to deliver that experience to every person that walks in.
23:32
Speaker 1
Yeah.
And, you know, to your point, a lot of us when we were in college, in between jobs, you know, worked at restaurants.
It was the easiest way to make some money, hold yourself and get ready for the next chapter in your life.
23:47
And actually, it still holds true.
Just not a lot of people take advantage of it because what they're doing is they're using Uber instead, right?
They're doing Amazon deliveries, they're doing Fiverr digital tasks, you know, stuff like that.
So there's the shortage really comes from there.
24:05
These young adults, you know, would rather sit in the car and just be told.
24:08
Speaker 3
Take a left, take a right.
24:09
Speaker 1
Pick up this person.
Drop off that person.
24:12
Speaker 3
You know, and my.
24:13
Speaker 1
Challenge with that because I've had to really look at it.
You know, my challenge with that is when you work for Uber or one of these, you know, gig economy jobs, it's great.
It's in the moment.
It can, you know, provide some income flexibility.
24:31
However it is, it can never be a career because even if you're a 5 point O Uber driver, you're not going to get a raise.
There's no manager that's going to say, hey, great job on your 5.0 Uber rating.
We're going to now give you a raise.
We're going to make you a manager, we're going to make your district director and blah, blah, blah, blah.
24:54
If you're an Uber driver, you always stay as an Uber driver.
So in the hospitality industry, as with most jobs, our job is to really cultivate those people and ensure that we give them a trajectory and a rear in a real career path.
25:11
And so as I mentioned before, most of my managers who run my high end restaurants have been met with me for a better part of a decade.
And most of them started off as hourly employees and now they're making, you know, they're the breadwinners and their families and, you know, they're married and supporting a family.
25:30
So that to us is important.
And making that as an example for whether it's our immigrant population and our workforce or any other young adult who's working for us, we want to really show them that there is a trajectory.
You can make a career out of this if you really love serving people and being hospitable.
25:51
You know that to us, those soft qualities, those soft metrics are critically important.
We're never going to IPO.
We're not going to come up with this like innovative thing that's going to change the world.
But what we can do is put smiles in people's faces.
And as an example, my general manager at La Pedrona, we just hit our anniversary, one year anniversary, and he was telling me the other day, one of the biggest things in his life is the Rolodex of people that text them on a daily basis or reservations.
26:29
And now he has become part of their life.
And we're talking about, you know, some of the biggest influencers CE OS private equity, you know, certainly here in Boston.
And so he's very proud of that moment that XY and Z is texting him for a reservation and he they asked them to go to their house or Thanksgiving or something along those lines.
26:53
So again, that to us is really, really fun to see because that's that is the best that we can give to our employees.
27:01
Speaker 3
You know I can't.
27:02
Speaker 1
Give a $3,000,000 salary to a line cook.
It's just not.
27:06
Speaker 3
You know we're not going to.
27:07
Speaker 1
IPO, as I mentioned, there is no private equity that really rolls into our businesses like this, so.
27:13
Speaker 2
I love that very different experience than I had when I when I was in college.
It was working at not fast food places, but it's the next level up.
Family restaurants have more cookie cutter kind of a situation and, and I remember it would, it felt far more transactional.
27:32
And what really caught me in a way that I was dumbfounded by was the psychology that I thought, if my manager treats me poorly, what's going to make me want to treat my customers well?
27:49
I'm being treated poorly.
So that gets passed down.
If they treat me amazingly well, and if they make me feel like I'm part of the product, like I'm part of the experience, that I'm, I have some sense of ownership in both the experience and the outcome, then of course I'm going to take more pride and then I'm going to do a better job.
28:07
And so it sounds to me like you put a lot of that thought into investing in your people, making sure that they are part of the overall delivery of the solution because they truly are.
28:18
Speaker 1
Exactly.
And what I always tell young entrepreneurs, you know, they'll, they'll reach out often and they'll say, I want to open up, you know what I call a muffin shop said, hey, Eric, I have this amazing muffin recipe and I want to open up a muffin shop.
What do you think?
28:33
And I usually give them the same advice that I got when I first opened up my my first place when I was 26.
I said, you're absolutely crazy.
Don't do it.
And you know, as a self-made entrepreneur, it's the worst advice to give because I want to support entrepreneurs.
28:51
I love it.
You know that that passion, but there's a cost that comes to it.
You know, everyone needs to listen to as many cautionary tales as possible because it's a very risky world out there.
But to my point, specifically on this is it to have a successful muffin shop almost has nothing to do with how good your muffin is because you're going to.
29:13
You got to give your free muffin to your friends and family because it is the best free.
This is the best muffin that I've ever had.
Of course they're going to say that it's free.
You gave it to them.
29:21
Speaker 3
But you know, it's very hard.
29:23
Speaker 1
To say, well, OK, now give me $2.00 for this muffin, what is it?
And now it's sort of triggers in a very different response to people and it gives them the authority to tell, to tell you whatever they really want to say, which again, we have to be a little bit thick skinned for that.
29:38
And so the next level of that is can you handle making that muffin over and over and over again because the success of the muffin shop.
29:49
Speaker 3
Has nothing to do with a muffin.
29:50
Speaker 1
You can always treat the recipe, but can you make it day in and day out, seven days a week, 365 days a year?
Whether it's raining, snow, shine, there's a graduation, there's a wedding that your guest doesn't care, They just want the muffin.
30:05
And so because we have that stress of that performance, non-stop performance.
30:10
Speaker 3
You know those.
30:10
Speaker 1
Soft qualities for us are critically important and and teaching that to our staff.
30:18
How to Immerse Guests in the Experience
Yeah, as you were talking about that muffin shop, I could almost smell it.
And it's part of the experience, right?
It's how do you immerse a person in the experience that they're seeking?
In the case of a muffin, I'm thinking of a bakery and, and the smell that comes along with that, that I can smell it before walking in the door and that makes my wet mouth water desiring that Italian bread or muffin or whatever it is they're making.
30:44
And, and with restaurants as well, right?
It's a lot of what you do seems to be very, very immersed in certain cultures, whether it be Greek or Italian or something.
So you look at something like that and, and you were also talking about Whole Foods and, and your experience eating in your grandmother's house back in Greece.
31:03
And I have the same experience in my grandmother's house in Chile.
31:07
How did you get to where you are?
As I think about all the different layers of what you're talking about, you're talking about user centered design, you're talking about the experience, you're talking about the food, you're talking about so many different factors that go into somebody going into your restaurant, the psychology, the cultures.
31:26
How do you how did you get to where you are?
Is this something that you've always aspired to?
You dreamed about being a restaurateur.
Was it something you did formally as training?
Because again, there are so many different layers of what you're talking about that it's not something you just kind of figure out overnight.
31:45
It's something that you've clearly built up over a career clearly by the accolades and the successes that you had.
But, you know, can you give us a, a sense of how you ended up where you are?
31:57
Speaker 3
So it came to that.
So I grew, I was born in the US and as soon as I was born, my family and I moved back to Greece.
So that's, that's really my, my first vision of life, as I mentioned earlier, was in these rural villages of Greece and running around.
32:19
And, and, you know, again, in the 80s was a very, very different life over there as most of the world was really cut off from the US.
And as an example, you know, Michael Jackson would, you know, have a song come out today.
32:35
By the time they got it in Greece, it could be five years later, right?
And So what we know today is that when Taylor Swift has a song that comes out today, instantly, it's heard around the world instantly.
So, you know, I always think about those moments.
32:51
And that's how I got started in hospitality.
So when we came back to the US, my dad ended up buying a little diner because he was an immigrant.
So I just, you know, and I worked washing dishes, you know, nine years old, ten years old, junior high and high school.
33:07
So that really started there and then went to undergrad and I studied finance and then I got 2 masters in finance.
I really like the quantitative part of my work, always did and had my first corporate job at Harvard University, which I really, really enjoyed.
33:26
But there was a part of me there that was just not happy.
And during my undergrad and graduate studies, I was bartending at nights.
I was really burning the candle in both both ends.
But that's what I did because I saw my parents work so hard as immigrants.
33:43
So I was like, yeah, naturally I'm going to work two things.
I'm going to work 2 jobs.
So, you know, I left Harvard in 2004 and opened up my first nightclub.
I just needed to do something on my own.
And really that's that's how I got started.
33:58
Now.
I was fortunate enough to work to have my corporate careers.
You know, I spent about 10 years.
I did tube a number of years at Ropes and Gray as well as there for about four years, another four years at Harvard.
So I have that corporate background, which is important as an entrepreneur.
34:17
I'm not always sort of shooting by the hip.
You know, I have to be a little bit more methodical.
So that's my analytical part of the brain and that's really how I build and how I develop my businesses.
But then, you know, on the personal side, on the dreamer part, on the the fun part, you know, that's, that's me when I was bartending, that's me when I was washing dishes.
34:38
So, you know, I'm always trying to stay connected to the guest.
And so nothing gets on the menu even to today, I have nine restaurants and building more.
Nothing gets on the menu until I sit at the table and I sign off on it.
And it's not that I have a great taste buds.
34:56
It's not that I am any better than anybody else.
I am just putting on the hat of my guest and how do they want to eat it?
Do they want to eat it like this?
Do they want to eat a fork?
Do they where's their napkin?
And, you know, how are they talking and eating?
Is it an appetizer is an entree?
35:12
So, you know, so all of that comes really from my experience growing up in Greece, you know, working at my dad's washing dishes, bartending through undergrad.
And, you know, now, you know, I still have to keep that experience up.
And you know, I, I travel, you know, internationally, I wouldn't say weekly, but certainly twice a month I'm out of my house and I'm travelling and I'm just eating food.
35:37
I'm just, I'm interested to see how people are entertaining themselves themselves.
How do they're, you know, what's cool at a restaurant?
Are they drinking wine, cocktails?
What's the music and the ambiance and, and all of those things.
And really I was able to kind of take all of that as well and shift it into real estate.
35:56
That's another big portfolio of mine nowadays, but it, it really has the same elements as hospitality.
It's instead of, you know, in hospitality we find an obscure location and we serve chicken and we hope that you drive from somewhere and pay money for that chicken and then you go home.
36:15
In real estate is a little bit the same thing.
You know, you build a really great product.
They don't come for the night, they come for the month or really for the year, you know, year a year long lease.
And now, now you have a, you've captured a guest for a longer duration of time.
36:32
And so, you know, I bring to my real estate the same methodologies and the same thought process that I have in hospitality.
And it's, it's worked out really well.
Not because again, that, that I'm, I'm more interesting than anyone else.
I'm just always putting myself in the eyes of the guest.
36:51
Speaker 2
That's great.
And so we talked about innovation, but there's also competition and there are a lot of restaurants and big cities like Boston.
To what level does that factor into your thinking?
You know, as I think about it, I'm going to say something from the outside in, right?
37:07
So it may be relevant and may not.
There are some sports that you play where you have direct competition.
If you're playing soccer, you have people against you trying to take that ball and put it against your goal, just like you're trying to do it to them.
When you're playing golf, you're playing against yourself.
There are sure there are other people that are want to win that trophy, but you win or lose based on how you do your, your game doesn't influence other people.
37:30
How to compete with the big guys
And I'm guessing that restaurants are a little bit of both.
A lot of what we talked about right now is your vision, your execution and how you treat your clientele and the experience that you give them.
But they also have the option of going to the restaurant that's right next door or right downstairs or down the way, right?
37:47
So to what level does that competition factor into your thinking?
Or do you just think, stay in my lane, execute, do what I know best and people will just show up?
37:58
Speaker 3
The latter, the latter totally.
You know, we are a commodity based business and restaurants will come and go.
We know that.
You know, I operate one of my Salinikis, which is fast casual.
I operate right next to literally a sweet green and a Chipotle.
38:16
And I did that really by design.
I really needed to prove to myself and to my team that a product has to be so good that we have to be able to compete with these Goliaths.
And I think that's very, very important.
And I know that tomorrow another place is going to open up next to us and so on and so forth.
38:35
But, you know, failure is inevitable in business, certainly in the restaurants.
I know at some point my restaurants will close.
Hopefully I'm not, you know, alive when that happens.
Hopefully I'll be able to sustain them for a very, very long time.
38:51
But I do know that at some point restaurants will close, but really even more from a shorter time frame.
We know that Starbucks and McDonald's close locations.
So again, when we think about some of the, you know, Goliaths in the room, the £800 gorillas, these public companies, they even get the formula wrong.
39:10
So for us, it's, it's more doing our homework up in the, the front end of the concept.
Are we in the right city?
Are we in the right neighborhood?
Are we on the right block and are we on the right side of the block?
Because if you know, even that can make a really big difference, particularly on what the concept is.
39:27
How far is that consumer willing to go?
If it's a fast casual, they really don't want to go far because they have an hour for lunch and they don't want to spend it walking to to the destination.
But something like a la Pedrona, which is a very much, very different experience.
You know, we have people that will drive or some people that will fly in for that experience.
39:47
And so we are always thinking about that competition is always around, but we don't think about it as competition from our peers.
We think about competition as us being able to execute the best of our abilities every single time.
40:02
Speaker 2
That's great.
And you know, for the record, I know precisely the corner of the Salaniki you're talking about.
It's right next to Sweet Greens, across the street from Chipotle.
My Harvard office is just in the corner right there.
And I'm not saying this just because I'm talking to you, but I always choose Salaniki.
40:20
When I would go out to lunch, I'd walk right by Chipotle, I'd skip Sweet Greens, and I'd go there to have my Giro or something because the food was so great.
And so it's it's funny to just come full circle now I hear about that quarter.
40:33
Speaker 3
Great.
I appreciate that.
Thank you.
That means a lot.
40:35
Speaker 2
To me, of course, it was great.
The, you know, we talked a little bit about external factors.
40:43
How external factors impact restaurant design
We talked about COVID, we talked about the federal government right now and the things that they're looking into to.
To what extent do external factors play into your current restaurants or your future thinking as well?
I mean, there's technology, technological disruptions as regulation, consumer behavior.
41:00
We talked a little bit about this.
This factors into your design as well or not really, because you go so down to the roots of what makes family home cooking part of your package, right?
41:16
And you just, that is such a core memory for people that when you're designing a restaurant around your grandmother's kitchen and grease, well, technology, regulation and consumer behavior have nothing on that because that's going to be a timeless experience that people are going to seek.
41:33
Speaker 3
I hope so, Nick, again, culturally, you know, we, I'm, I'm old enough to see cultural patterns shift, you know, not not even necessarily from Greece to here, but the way that families are interacting, the way that family, you know, I have a lot of friends who have young kids and how are they raising their kids?
41:57
Are they eating in or are they going out?
I have, you know, a lot of my friends are probably, you know, ordering out maybe six nights a week, you know, with their young kids.
So again, so you know, in 15 years and 20 years that consumers going to be coming into the restaurants and what are they expecting?
42:16
So, you know, we are sort of thinking about that stuff.
But I think what's what keeps me up at night is when will technology, you know, come into our business and why?
42:32
Speaker 1
Hasn't it And.
42:32
Speaker 3
Wall Street Journal had a great article a few months ago with Steve Ells, who's the founder of Chipotle.
He's obviously a billionaire and super smart guy.
And they just, you know, can't figure out robotics yet and technology and, and food.
42:54
And you think, I mean, it's, it's like, you know, we use robots to build cars.
Why can't we use a robot to slice a tomato?
And what we have seen more recently, there's a concept called Spice Kitchen SPYCE, and they started out here in Boston.
43:10
It was for MIT, young MIT students or graduates.
And there it was almost like a sweet green kind of a concept, but there was only one human working the store.
Everything was robotics and IT.
43:23
Speaker 1
Was really cool.
It was.
43:24
Speaker 3
Awesome, awesome.
Like you ordered on an, on an iPad and then magically you saw this thing work and cook and put your salad together, put your bowl together.
But it never worked as a retail location.
Now Sweet Green bought their technology and now those four MIT kids are working with Sweet Green.
43:45
And you know, there's, they're still trying.
But you know what we're talking about.
Seven years ago, so did it.
Did the retail not work because humans want to see someone else cooking their food and putting love into their food or, or is it something else?
And so again, to my question or to my answer, what keeps me up at night is, you know, when is technology going to come in for us and when is it going to be a real, real asset?
44:11
You know, our, our biggest technology is really our POS, our point of sale system.
And again, I think in the in, you know, it's nothing fancy, it's nothing groundbreaking.
You know, we see what we sold and that's about it.
And specifically, you know, for technology, again, it's the staffing issue and the cultural and political divide in our country.
44:35
You know, what does that mean for the workforce that is serving not just restaurants, but hotels and also farms?
You know, that's a big part that we sometimes forget in our conversations.
You know, certainly up here in the Northeast, there isn't a lot of farms.
So, you know, the farm workers isn't a big conversation, but you know, where is our food coming from?
44:54
Is it sustainable?
Do we have a big workforce and and all of that stuff.
So that's really what keeps me up at night in my industry.
45:04
Speaker 2
And those things change.
I mean, before you were talking about part of the labor shortage is that these young kids are driving Uber, but Uber, we know, is trying to automate driving.
And so those people are going to be looking for something else in three, five years or so, right?
45:20
So they may come right back into industry because of exactly what you said, automating that for whatever reason, and it could be as simple as sharing a meal is such a human thing.
It's how we bond, right?
And so now trying to replace an element of that with robot seems counterintuitive to how we're wired as human beings, but we'll see how that plays out.
45:43
But in the last few minutes that we have, if we project forward, we talked a little bit about this.
45:49
How to be competitive in the food industry
When you're thinking about where the industry is going and how you position yourself to be competitive in that space.
If you're thinking about yourself, if you're thinking about other people trying to carve a, a wedge for themselves and, and they aspire to to have a career that you've had or open up a restaurant.
46:06
How do you see this industry evolving over the next five years or so?
And what kind of advice would you give somebody?
It's like I want to, I want to start a restaurant.
46:20
Speaker 3
That's a great question.
Amazon, I think is also a disruptor in the food business and not because of, you know, Amazon.com, but you know, even for myself as well, I live in downtown Boston.
46:36
There's Acvs literally across the street from me.
And if I run out of toothpaste, I'm just going to go on my Amazon app and get that toothpaste.
And so that really changes retail for us.
And you know, that's that's why when I mentioned Amazon, it's really from a foot traffic standpoint.
46:56
And as I mentioned before, you know, we you have to be on the right side of the street and you know, you have to, you have to, and particularly not because of the work from home, you know, post COVID, we have to work so much harder to draw people out of their houses and to come and spend time in our spaces.
47:16
So as you know, young entrepreneurs, I really have to think, think about or tell them to be thinking about that as well.
And then also the disruption in the workforce.
And ultimately what's hardest, the hardest thing in in our business is Thursday, Friday, Saturday at 7:00 PM is like a Monday morning, 9:00 AM for the the regular person here in the US.
47:41
So, you know, we work exceptionally long hours, You know, for me, you know, I'm not at my restaurants, you know, to open up and get the pasta ready for service.
But I am up early in the morning because I have to deal with my attorneys.
47:56
I got to deal with my finance, I got to deal with my developers, to look for new sites and to do the analytics on the company and how are we doing?
And then, you know, by 5 o'clock 5:00 PM, that's actually Showtime.
That's when all the restaurants open.
So how are we ready for Showtime?
48:13
And so for the young entrepreneurs or any age entrepreneur in our industry, that's a really big thing is, you know, some, you know, people, people will say that restaurants or bars and nightclubs, you know, they're a young man's game or young person's game.
I certainly see that.
48:29
And particularly now that I'm in my, you know, late 40s, you know, I'm, I'm very grateful that I'm on the other side, that I don't have to be on my feet on, you know, in front of a grill.
But I do have to go and see my VI PS tonight and go say hi, go shake hands and go see how my management, my management staff is doing.
48:50
And the last thing for young entrepreneurs is our business has incredibly razor thin margins.
I went to this beautiful restaurant on Saturday night in Jamaica Plains, probably has like 30 seats, probably not even 20 to 30 seats.
49:07
And the young chef owner was there.
He was probably no older than 3032 years old.
Incredibly hard to get a reservation.
Awesome food, awesomeness, attention to detail, and what's going on through my mind is I hope this kid makes it to the other side.
49:24
There's a lot of them don't because it's such a tough, physically demanding job and your margins are paper thin.
You know, when you're talking about, you know, profit margins industry wide in the country, I think it's between 2 and 5%.
So when someone comes in and spends 100 dollars, $2.00 will go to the owner's pocket.
49:45
The owner may have investors or loans, but $2.00 will get down to the bottom line.
And if you end up returning your meal because you didn't like your steak, it was overcooked, it could have been legitimate.
Now when we have to cook you a different steak, now, you know we're losing money on you.
50:05
And so that's, you know, very, very tough proposition.
That's where you see restaurants turn over and the most successful ones are the ones that I've put a lot of time in their SOP and their standards and have been able to figure out that secret formula of attracting the guest to the restaurant.
50:21
And I think that's the toughest thing.
You don't know, you might like, you know, Peruvian food and you're like, I'm going to open up Peruvian vet restaurant because it's the best food and you might put the best Peruvian restaurant.
But if the masses don't want it, and it could be, again, like I said, the best food, but if the masses aren't getting it, it's it's tough.
50:44
It's tough.
50:45
Speaker 2
Yeah, and so many intangibles.
You know, you hear all the time about location, location, location and so many different things.
But Eric, this has been tremendous.
First of all, congratulations in your success.
I know that it's a fiercely competitive space.
And so the fact that you've had such great accomplishments is just kudos to you, your approach, your team, and everything that goes into your restaurants.
51:07
This has been tremendously insightful for me and I'm sure for people listening as well.
Thank you so much for your time.
I really enjoyed this and I look forward to walking into Solaniki next time I'm in that area.
51:18
Speaker 3
Awesome, thank you.
And yeah, please, please come in.
I'd love to have you come check out one of the restaurants, particularly La Padrona.
It's such a wonderful treat over there.
